Final TFA Lightsaber Duel Discussion [SPOILERS]

[Jedieb]

[Interesting discussion that I saw at TFN. Basically, just how was Rey able to defeat Ren? Rey never should have had a chance against Ben/Ren. He'd obviously had enough power and demonstrated enough skill in the film that he should have made short work of her. Here are the reasons I originally accepted her winning that fight;
1. She knows how to take of herself. We see it on Jakku. She can fight with a staff and she's obviously had a hard life that's taught her how to protect herself.
2. Ben fights wildly, aggressively, and arrogantly. He constantly loses control of his emotions. Vader calmly force choked people. Ben destroys furniture if the Starkiller base cafeteria messes up his lunch order.
3. As powerful as Ben is, his training isn't complete. Snoke tells us this at the end of the movie.
4. He's injured. Just before he takes Finn down, Finn got a lucky shot in. But the big wound is of course Chewie's bowcaster shot. Since the OT many of us have dreamed of seeing that baby in action and we finally did. I think that shot would have killed most people. Only a strong Force user could survive.

Those were enough for me. But I read a new theory today that I really like. Ren is taking it easy on Rey because he knows Rey's parentage and desperately wants to convert her to the dark side. He knows he's fighting his COUSIN/SISTER! He knows this because he's the one who dropped her off on Jakku. She was the lone survivor of the massacre at the Jedi Temple. He found her and his conflict with the Light caused him to spare her. It would explain why she was dropped off at Jakku to be raised in such a harsh environment. Maybe Ren thought this would make her easier to turn when she was older. It would also explain why she was able to call the saber to her. Ren was trying to get his Grandfather and Uncle's saber, but Rey was reaching out for Daddy's saber. Daddy wins!

You put all that together, and that's how you get the upset.]

[Jain Terius]

Don't forget the extra [ brackets ] to hide your spoilers from the activity feed!

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[ I definitely feel at this point that "Rey Skywalker" is the mostly likely identity. Perhaps it is the obvious option, but it's the one that fits the best to me. There are plenty of other movies for Disney to bring us non-Skywalker protagonists, but for the Episodes it just feels "right" that the main character should be the next Skywalker. There's a nice symmetry to it, too, a nice echo of the whole "bring balance to the Force" idea - Luke, Ben, and Rey could perhaps be seen as echoing the Father/Son/Daughter triad from Mortis, in terms of their roles/affinity/balance if not in terms of literal familial connections. If she isn't a Skywalker, that's going to be quite the anti-climax, especially when it seems so probable at this point. Also, there's just something about the idea of "Uncle Han" that makes all those scenes between the two of them feel even nicer to me. ]

[ That said, I just don't buy the idea that Ren held back because the two of them were related. Having just killed his father in the hopes that it would purge that pesky light side from him, it doesn't follow that he would spare her. Holding back in that instance would be giving in to the light that he's trying so hard to fight against - surely, his desire to overcome his conscience and embrace the darkness would make him want to fight even harder so that he can kill her as well, so as to destroy everything that's trying to lure him back into being good? ]

[ For me, I think it was a mix of injury, possibly the emotional trauma of having just killed his father ("This was supposed to end my emotional conflict. Why do I feel pain/guilt?"), and maybe a little bit of sheer surprise. Ben just sacrificed his father in order to embrace the unlimited power of the dark side, and then suddenly this girl closes her eyes for a few seconds, and out of nowhere there's new strength and power. He is instantly pushed onto the defensive, and putting yourself in his shoes, that's got to be a bit of an alarming turn of events. He is so sure that the dark side is more powerful, and yet here is the light side kicking his ass. Has he been lied to? Did he sacrifice his father for nothing? ]

[Alis'ans'amey]

[ I think you can make a sound argument for Rey holding her own. Ren is injured, and actually shown to not be very good with that lightsaber of his. He failed to block blaster bolts, and even Finn, an untrained stormtrooper without Jedi reflexes, can fight him reasonably effectively (even if he lost). But with Rey, I still think that she had some training as a child. The fact that her visions include Ren's murder of the Jedi, Luke's island and so on, I'd be surprised if they aren't hinting that she's just forgotten she was trained when she was little. (Or perhaps even mind-wiped, Revan style, if they use some EU influence). ]

[Morgan Evanar]

[
I HOPE that she was simply part of Luke's Academy, and when he dissolved it she was smartly hidden. I'm hoping it's not Yet Another Family Thing in Star Wars, but I'm weird.]

[Lilaena De'Ville]

Personally I think [Rey is totally unrelated to the Skywalkers or the Academy. She has personal memories of the ocean and the island that they find Luke on - which he had not located before going into exile after the massacre. Her vision of the massacre does not mean she was there - the Force shows you things you have no knowledge of (Luke's vision of Han and Leia on Bespin).]

[TTony Ath-Thu'ban]

Are they [personal memories of that island, though? It could also be an indicator that she has some sort of connection with Luke, and is able to sense where he is. Leia - who has no real Force training at all - was able to sense Han's death. Imagine what could happen if both ends of that connection were potent Force-users.]

[Alis'ans'amey]

Yeah, it could very easily be [ memories or a vision, it's unclear. Personally, I like the idea of her being a Skywalker because that keeps the saga in the family line. That and she looks so similar to Natalie Portman it'd totally make sense. But who her mother could be is a real mystery.

My only regret with Mark Hamill's appearance is since he's been in Flash recently the novelty of seeing Mark Hamill again isn't as fresh for me ]

[Jedieb]

[ I think Ren's holding back in portions of their duel could be a combination of some inner light side turmoil AND his seeing an opportunity for an apprentice. The Sith were always looking for fresh meat. I love the possibilities the Knights of Ren present. I was never that crazy about only having 2 Sith at a time. The idea of a fresh take on Dark Side users really has me excited. Maybe Ren saw Rey as a young Force user he could turn and then one day use to overthrow Snoke. ]

Can't wait to get the novelization and pour over it for backstory and clues to what comes next. I bought the Art of TFA today. On the sleeve it says The Making of TFA book comes out this spring. Sweeeeet.